S3EP56 - Morality

Pastor Bill:

[0:00] Hello and welcome to season 3 episode 56 of the Berean Manifesto: Faith, Hope, and Love for the modern Christian. I'm Pastor Bill and I'm joined, by a man who has pretty much had it with me today he is at his wits end of my Shenanigans today.

 

Pastor Newms:

[0:22] I am not, I'm good I'm good.

 

Pastor Bill:

[0:23] Pastor Newms all the way from the state of Tennessee he even had to throw on a Tennessee beanie,

to calm himself down we've been having a quite intense conversation most of the afternoon.

 

Pastor Newms:

[0:46] It was an intense it was intense all afternoon just part of the afternoon. And I took my meds let's.

 

Pastor Bill:

[0:57] I took my meds.

 

Pastor Newms:

[0:59] No I'm saying let's be clear because there are times when that's a valid question when I get the mood.

 

Pastor Bill:

[1:04] Take my meds right it all right so how was your week Pastor Newms?

 

Pastor Newms:

[1:33] I did play satisfactory Christmas came out. Yeah, it came out twice it came out they pulled it because it wasn't ready and then they put it back out the next day which was only like a couple hours later I and I worked a bunch. But there wasn't anything eventful the kids are still here we're all in quarantine no one else has gotten sick so beginning of next week everyone is out of quarantine. Not much.

 

Pastor Bill:

[2:15] I'm because all right we wrapped up a story arc in Star Trek and then went into the events that aren't really that crucial from my personal opinion unless you're you know want to, grind a bunch of hostiles which Pastor Newms likes to do, I like to use it as kind of a Down time in between story arcs because I'm all about the story arc stories in in games I like the stuff that you're doing for a reason discuss story behind it's not, do this to get stronger it's do this because they did this and you need to give them you know you need to take revenge on these dogs you know I like it storyline, um and, my I got my car towed to a different shop because the first shop said the problems you have or too intense for our shop, don't actually pull apart engine blocks to do repairs, so you're going to take this to a dealership so we took you to the dealership the dealership was like yeah our standard diagnostic isn't intense enough for what your problem is we're actually gonna have to do the special Diagnostic and that was the last I heard, so Yeah other than that we went to a Christmas parade yesterday that was fun indicator on the Decatur square the Christmas parade indicator has gotten much much longer than back in the day when I was in marching band, um what year is it right now 2021 so we're talking, 21 years ago I graduated from high school the parade has gotten much bigger I marched in that parade for times and it was never that big 20 years ago it was much smaller, most of the floats were handing out candy and well float.

 

Pastor Newms:

[4:14] Were they and where.

 

Pastor Bill:

[4:14] Monster trucks and floats and.

 

Pastor Newms:

[4:17] Were they handing out candy.

 

Pastor Bill:

[4:19] No they weren't handing out candy at all I was gonna get to that, and all but one float or one entry into the parade they have just looked ecstatic to be there they were super happy there was there was only one float that wasn't happy and, as what's say we won't talk about that on the air I just wanted it to be known that that most of the floats were just full of happy people and having a great time and no they weren't handing out candy they were chunking candy into the audience.

 

Pastor Newms:

[4:54] Oh okay.

 

Pastor Bill:

[4:55] In the head six different times.

 

Pastor Newms:

[4:59] Mmm.

 

Pastor Bill:

[5:00] Zero throughout the course of this parade is our long parade three of those however was all from one float and I was like I give up I give up, the candles anymore.

 

Pastor Newms:

[5:14] Stop hitting me in the head.

 

Pastor Bill:

[5:15] Hit me in the head with candy most people were just throwing it at the ground at our feet and it would slide a good amount of with slide under the barrier right in front of us, so that was but it was good it was a really good parade and there were as a bat brain yelled on Twitch most rude, I was probably a good I don't know seven or eight monster trucks they came rolling through honking their horns and revving their engines and read it over.

 

Pastor Newms:

[5:41] Now where they where they really monster trucks or was it just we live in the country so jacked up trucks are a big thing.

 

Pastor Bill:

[5:49] No they were genuine like I've seen some battle damage and I've got big tires and I'm built to too bad with other cars monster trucks it was.

 

Pastor Newms:

[6:01] Just checking cuz I know you know.

 

Pastor Bill:

[6:05] I think one of them had a sign said it was from Weatherford or something like they weren't even local they were just you know coming to be a part of the parade which is cool, um I was fine and then there's a drive-through like display here in Decatur this year called radiance. We didn't know if they were going to charge her for is free and we assumed it was going to charge but we didn't know how much so we pull up to the Little Shack we were like how much is it, and they were like well it's only $30 to get in, but you can also for 20 extra dollars get a small bag of candy for each person in your car and hot cocoa and these cool little glasses see the lights as special shapes, and Roxanne look at me and she was like what do you think and I was like I don't want to pay twenty dollars for a bag of candy I think that and she was like yeah I don't think we're gonna do tonight so into labor were like how do we get out and they were like, I don't know how do you get out and so they had to call their manager and and they were like go this way and the measure walked with the car and was like, yeah we got so many cars coming in right now why don't you just go on to go on through just just go on so we got to go through the, 30 dollar light display for free which was cool, it would actually wasn't that bad it wasn't $30 worth but if they've been charging in like 20 bucks I'd say it was Charlie was you know charged correctly it was it was that level of amount of lights and.

 

Pastor Newms:

[7:36] It was good but it wasn't 30 dollar good.

 

Pastor Bill:

[7:39] Right it was good but it wasn't 30 dollar good at one point there were these three spiders and it was like spiders why are there infinite was like I love the spiders and we were like okay yeah that I get now what they included spiders kids are awesome.

 

Pastor Newms:

[7:54] So I did forget Nissan the Nissan plant here did a thing where you could go to and it was all kinds of lights and they had our stuff and, cookies and all that kind of stuff and my Biggs took the girls there and it was, lights at a factory which was cool I did forget about that I didn't go I had bad Chinese food.

 

Pastor Bill:

[8:22] Yeah so that was my week all right so on Twitter we've got the best 13:17 our friend groggy our little groggy we got a bat, my little groggy.

 

Pastor Newms:

[8:35] My little groggy my little groggy okay.

 

Pastor Bill:

[8:42] We've got a bat brain on Twitch we've got Biggs is joining us on Twitch I'm assuming that means that Mama Gloria is there with Biggs.

 

Pastor Newms:

[8:48] I don't know if I I don't know if I like Mama Gloria that sounds my mama's name is Gloria.

 

Pastor Bill:

[8:57] Mama she go mama.

 

Pastor Newms:

[8:59] Groggy Tales bouncing here and there and everywhere that's that works too.

 

Pastor Bill:

[9:05] It was a different song all together okay.

 

Pastor Newms:

[9:07] Okay I went with Gummy Bears.

 

Pastor Bill:

[9:09] I went to Dragon Tales.

 

Pastor Newms:

[9:11] Oh oh okay.

 

Pastor Bill:

[9:16] Hey stop talking about your mother-in-law saying she's weird Zaydiee that's not cool Zaydiees with us on Twitch, hiya Bat-Brain reminded me we had a date an anniversary date my 16th anniversary was this weekend, are this week yes we are joined by rain on Discord and Phoenix is joining us in the Discord as well, but yeah my anniversary was this week and we tried to have an awesome date indicator, you really did we try to go to Aurora to go to a place called Martian Margaritas which, you know something fun it's an alien, thing there's no little sachet of aliens and it's all built around the Aurora alien story from the 1800's about a, crashed alien ship and this little one of the greys little alien met the townsfolk and and then he tried to leave and they shot his ship down and then he's supposedly buried over and Aurora um about 15 minutes away from my home and so we try to go there but they had closed early, and we rely and then we went to the barbecue place that's right there with it just a little hole-in-the-wall place and they were like we're sold out we're closing up shop now early ourselves because, we had such a rush we're sold out of all of our Meats. So let me try to go to Chili's and the chilies indicator is woefully understaffed right now so there was large crowds of people waiting outside and I okay fine we'll go to fuzzies on the square, got there and there was karaoke running and not good karaoke like this place is not designed for loud noises, karaoke and so.

 

Pastor Newms:

[11:10] Don't they have like mostly like metal everywhere so it would be a ton of reverberation in stuff.

 

Pastor Bill:

[11:16] It's like the concrete floor and the metal walls and then they've got that ornate 10 ceiling structure.

 

Pastor Newms:

[11:22] Yeah yeah okay so it's the same as the other fuzzy so it's not yeah.

 

Pastor Bill:

[11:32] Um and yeah so that was added an anniversary date this year I've been married for 16 years, about that all right well.

 

Pastor Newms:

[11:48] There's some time.

 

Pastor Bill:

[11:51] What that's that's time that's sometime.

 

Pastor Newms:

[11:52] That's time we're getting old.

 

Pastor Bill:

[11:56] Mmm Yeah I mean.

 

Pastor Newms:

[11:58] That's how time works typically.

 

Pastor Bill:

[12:01] That is how time works to.

 

Pastor Newms:

[12:03] Unless you're Merlin.

 

Pastor Bill:

[12:05] Okay we won't tonight we are talking about.

 

Pastor Newms:

[12:26] I think it's cuz we sang the theme song so it's um.

 

Pastor Bill:

[12:32] So he switched over.

 

Pastor Newms:

[12:32] Now.

 

Pastor Bill:

[12:34] I got you yeah so this tonight we're talking about morality and, it's going to be it's going to be a fun night we're going to have fun Newms hates that we talked about this as often as we do, either there's someone listening that needs to hear this conversation or it keeps coming up, I need to hear some learn something or Newms needs somebody needs to learn something because I keep getting prompted to talk about this and I'm not, immune to needing to learn things so it could very well be that Pastor Bill is the one, needs to be hearing about this conversation over and over again so we'll see or we may not see but anyway alright so it is time.

 

Pastor Newms:

[13:24] Dude if we talk about it it just a little bit of time again.

 

Pastor Bill:

[13:27] And it's time for getting to know the pastors and pastor newms already had his card pulled and what does it say pastor newms.

 

Pastor Newms:

[13:38] Interesting if you could be anywhere in the world world for New Year's Eve this year where would you want, where where would you most want to be.

 

Pastor Bill:

[14:03] Anywhere in the world all.

 

Pastor Newms:

[14:06] And groggy is in two places because he wants to be here.

 

Pastor Bill:

[14:11] Groggy wants to be with you for New Year's Eve.

 

Pastor Newms:

[14:13] And you know groggy that could actually probably happen if you're wanting to be with us for New Year's Eve just.

 

Pastor Bill:

[14:22] Beef New Year's Eve.

 

Pastor Newms:

[14:22] Hit up Zaydiee because you know I don't plan things so talk to her I personally my favorite place to be New Year's would be, right here at my computer because that's where I like spending most holidays but. There's I don't like to travel a lot rain would like to be given a castle and a fire-breathing dragon and then be there.

 

Pastor Bill:

[15:07] I have no special place I'd like to be.

 

Pastor Newms:

[15:11] I think you should come to Tennessee to we can all just be here for New Year's it's an expensive driver though.

 

Pastor Bill:

[15:22] Everything's expensive travels, breathing is expensive.

 

Pastor Newms:

[15:28] Yeah.

 

Pastor Bill:

[15:29] Phoenix says she wants to be with the doctor do you have a death wish.

 

Pastor Newms:

[15:33] You're not on not around holidays.

 

Pastor Bill:

[15:36] The doctor and holidays those are bad times to be.

 

Pastor Newms:

[15:41] Those are always sad I Don't Want to Be Right.

 

Pastor Bill:

[15:44] Cool Spacey stuff until some cool spaces Dove eats you, the doctors like I tried.

 

Pastor Newms:

[15:56] Because Phoenix has bad luck she would get eaten straight up like or just get left accidentally like oh we forgot about her, actually started.

 

Pastor Bill:

[16:14] I would probably get assimilated into a Cyberman who then got captured and turned into a Dalek and so I'd be just as horribly, disfigured and tortured Soul we're running around the Galaxy yelling assimilate or exterminate assimilate or exterminate just as long as something.

 

Pastor Newms:

[16:47] One of the little cyber mice you get turned into them.

 

Pastor Bill:

[16:50] Oh yeah.

 

Pastor Newms:

[16:50] Steve enough genetic material left to all right. Maura.

 

Pastor Bill:

[17:05] We didn't really get to know much about us buy that card but that's fine.

 

Pastor Newms:

[17:08] We didn't we didn't do you want another one.

 

Pastor Bill:

[17:11] Sure. How would I would end up with a hole in my forehead I would end up with the the snap in my the little porthole would open to suck up information.

 

Pastor Newms:

[17:31] What is the greatest lesson in life you have.

 

Pastor Bill:

[17:41] Um To put more effort into the relationships that I have while I have them, instead of later regretting not, saying yes to that certain thing not preferring someone else in that situation over myself, because all of my regrets all of my regrets stem from I was selfish in that scenario and it hurt that friend or I didn't do enough for that friend and that happened or. What about you Pastor Newms.

 

Pastor Newms:

[18:52] Compound interest is important. Yeah something that everyone should remember much more than we do.

 

Pastor Bill:

[19:12] Compound interest ruins lives.

 

Pastor Newms:

[19:16] And saves them.

 

Pastor Bill:

[19:19] If you're if you're lucky enough to get on the right end of that.

 

Pastor Newms:

[19:33] Is compound interest is more important than short-term gains sometimes.

 

Pastor Bill:

[19:42] Then he says what ah that was loud.

 

Pastor Newms:

[19:45] A nice.

 

Pastor Bill:

[19:46] Um I don't know what was that he saying what about Bizet he's saying what.

 

Pastor Newms:

[19:50] It's pricing what to what I said.

 

Pastor Bill:

[19:54] About compound interest.

 

Pastor Newms:

[19:56] Right cuz, it's both bad and good depending on like you said which side you're on.

 

Pastor Bill:

[20:10] Bad if you're the lender or if you're the the borrower good if you're the lender.

 

Pastor Newms:

[20:27] Compound interest is the interest that happens when you're getting interest on interest so if you have a bank account and you give an interest and you don't remove anything the next interest is compound interest, the on a loan if you don't make your payments correctly and when you're trying to pay off interest and then you're getting interest on interest so compound interest is can be painful or can be great.

 

Pastor Bill:

[21:05] Said he's like okay that's I just it's huge.

 

Pastor Newms:

[21:09] I said Never mind already.

 

Pastor Bill:

[21:11] Because I had never mind. All right so. Morality.

 

Pastor Newms:

[21:23] Let's start with the verse.

 

Pastor Bill:

[21:26] Let's start yeah let's started in Romans chapter 5, let's start in verse 12 put that in the chat Romans 5 verses 12 through, 13 the, silly goose all right therefore just as Sin entered the world through one man and death through sin in this way death spread to all people because all sinned, in fact sin was in the world before the law but sin is not charged to a person's account when there is no law, now Paul Paul has some, you know multi-sided things that are going on here in this conversation, because he says nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses even over those who did not send in the likeness of Adam's transgression he has a tap of the coming, but also if we go back to Romans chapter 2. That's romance to not 20 12 and we're looking at.

 

Pastor Newms:

[22:53] Twelve you can start at 11 technically and no because it starts with a for you want to start with a 4.

 

Pastor Bill:

[23:02] Twelve through, that yeah 16 because newms wants that 16 to be in there pretty bad so yeah you were advocating for that to be the actual scripture book.

 

Pastor Newms:

[23:21] No yeah you're right here right.

 

Pastor Bill:

[23:24] All who sin without the law will also perish without the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law for the hearers of the law are not righteous before God but the doers of the law will be justified, so when Gentiles who do not by Nature have the law do what the law demands they are a law to themselves even though they do not have the law, they show that the work of their love the law is written on their hearts, their Consciousness has confirmed this they're competing thoughts either accuse or even excuse them on the day when God judges, and what he's judging is because I split that when I should have put it in my the way I was reading it when God judges what people have kept, according to my gospel through Christ Jesus Paul Same Day Gospel he's preaching through Christ Jesus, and that's a big thing for policies he says it again later as you know if somebody comes and tries to teach you a gospel other than what I've brought you, then you need to flee their they're trying to trick you they're trying to lie to you either. So that's that's really confusing Pastor names you want to break that down for us he uses that word law several times back and forth and back and forth and so breakdown this, Romans 2 12 through 16 for us so we can understand what is Paul saying here, is he says he talking about one law to lost three lot what is he talking about.

 

Pastor Newms:

[25:03] So in this he's talking about at least two, basically the law that he's talking about, in the beginning is the law that was given to Moses so, the book books of the law so those who sin without the Bible, the books of the law those those five main books will perish without ever knowing those five books and those who, I have sinned under the law meaning they know the books and the they, will be judged by those books okay.

 

Pastor Bill:

[25:52] Okay so pause so you're saying when we get to the Judgment at the end and our life is laid out in front of us we're going to be judged by separate.

 

Pastor Newms:

[26:14] The hearers of the law are not righteous because we break it but the door the laws will be justified so to me the people who are trying, and in following the rules will be justified, and in that at the point we are now is also the third law which is the law under, Jesus which is the law that then can do justification because the books of the law cannot justify. The Gentiles who do not have the books of the law do what the law demands because that law was also written on their hearts and their Consciousness has, you know it's kind of that whole thing where there are you know most of the Ten Commandments it's not humans naturally know these are, good and bad right or wrong.

 

Pastor Bill:

[27:21] Find that play out all over the world every culture we find these basic.

 

Pastor Newms:

[27:26] Yeah.

 

Pastor Bill:

[27:28] Ten agreements that everyone can agree upon these things we should do.

 

Pastor Newms:

[27:35] Yeah aside from the ones specifically about God but yes the overall.

 

Pastor Bill:

[27:44] Side of being raised in a theistic Evangelical culture most people just naturally look at the heavens and go I yearn to know who made that.

 

Pastor Newms:

[28:00] I agree, and then you know when God judges he's going to judge based on what people kept secret so there's three laws that are talked about throughout their in my opinion of what each of those mean.

 

Pastor Bill:

[28:20] How you used the word justification now that is not the same thing as being found innocent. You can still be found guilty and then someone look at your actions and go yeah I understand why you did that, but you're still guilty so Justified justification doesn't mean you get a free pass it means.

 

Pastor Newms:

[28:47] So that the Greek word is a word.

 

Pastor Bill:

[28:51] Is it work.

 

Pastor Newms:

[28:53] Dik Al no I oh oh and it means to render just or innocent, so it's it's to regard as to make innocent the justification process is not hey you are innocent it is to make someone, or regard them as innocent.

 

Pastor Bill:

[29:20] Except we both know that what Paul actually means is Christ fulfilled the law and the only way to actually be justified by following the law is to follow the law of, so and I'm trying to break this up this way because I want to establish, all the ways that we agree and where we come to the point where we're completely is sabbatical simpatico, and then if anyone's ever listen to bring my Manifesto at any point they've already heard my hot take, on all these issues, and so this is you know this is where we are all right so when when he says in Romans chapter 2 verse. 15 the law is written on their hearts and he's not talking on the hearts of the Jews Like Moses was talking about in Deuteronomy he's talking about everybody everybody has this law.

 

Pastor Newms:

[30:32] I mean I mean it plainly says Gentiles and then it's they they they that you know.

 

Pastor Bill:

[30:41] And so at what point did that law become written on the hearts of mankind.

 

Pastor Newms:

[30:51] I would assume based on what we understand from scripture that it was written at the time of eating the the from the Tree of the knowledge of Good and Evil, I think most people would agree with that.

 

Pastor Bill:

[31:10] Most people would agree with theologically allergens would agree with that most people are right on with that agreement that we receive the knowledge of Good and Evil we received a knowledge of the basic law, when Adam and Eve ate from the Tree of the knowledge of Good and Evil now we had a conversation earlier that I've never had any with anybody else before, and you put it in a way where it's never I've never had anybody say to me before and I knew I had a head knowledge, of the concept that you were talking about but no one had ever articulated it this way to me before.

 

Pastor Newms:

[31:49] Which you took a minute to get to the articulation let's be clear this is was not I did I didn't just come up with it on the Fly and it took a minute of travel no.

 

Pastor Bill:

[31:58] No you just wasn't just like you were like I'm a Wordsmith and I'm just gonna pull this out of my butt and it's going to make sense you were talking about Sin, before the fall of Man, so can you.

 

Pastor Newms:

[32:17] So there.

 

Pastor Bill:

[32:23] Start with I was raised.

 

Pastor Newms:

[32:28] Yeah there were times in the past that I was under teachers and what I was taught was that sin entered the world when the fruit was eaten.

 

Pastor Bill:

[32:42] Now pause because you just quoted Romans chapter 5, verse 12 however Paul then puts a stipulation which is verse 13 He says when in fact, now go ahead.

 

Pastor Newms:

[33:01] Sin was there already the fact of not being perfect was already in the world and we see this in the fact that, the eating of the Apple which yeah sorry I've tried to say fruit every time it's obviously not an apple that irritates me so.

 

Pastor Bill:

[33:35] Literally could be an apple of all of the fruits in the world apple strawberry watermelon the these things it couldn't have been because they didn't exist that far.

 

Pastor Newms:

[33:48] It could have been a special breed like a golden apple that don't exist anymore it could been special you see.

 

Pastor Bill:

[33:55] So a lot of a lot of theologians believe it was a pomegranate, and one of the reasons they believe this is because there's a lot of art deco, that shows a tree of life and another tree that is represented as a pomegranate tree going back several thousands of years, and also whenever we come across descriptions of asherah poles they're always described as having, on them yeah and so a lot of theologians have come to the conclusion that it must have been a pomegranate, that was representing the, the knowledge of Good and Evil on this tree not necessary that all pomegranates were evil but that this one particular tree grew.

 

Pastor Newms:

[34:53] Mmm cross pollination is weird sometimes but, Adam when he relayed the law, he related incorrectly the only law that had been given at that point was.

 

Pastor Bill:

[35:12] Mmm law Loosely law.

 

Pastor Newms:

[35:13] Laws yeah Loosely law was don't eat of that fruit to which Adam then turned to newly created Eve and said don't touch that tree it'll kill you.

 

Pastor Bill:

[35:26] Don't eat or touch.

 

Pastor Newms:

[35:28] Yeah eat or touch don't even touch it if you touch it you're going to die which of as we all know is how Satan was able to twist. I must have English you didn't twist English because just need to be traced because it's a horrible language.

 

Pastor Bill:

[35:50] Now in the now in the original it doesn't actually say that it is Satan, um that is an idea that comes across an English translations of the New Testament when the authors refer back and say, um the adversary say Tanis in Latin the adversary, inhabited The Serpent and went and talked to Eve and we then you know, apply that to being the devil being Satan being in the serpent now and in the text just says the serpent I don't want I don't want people who are legalistic you know to, the message of what we're saying because we use a colloquial list word that we've just gotten used to saying oh yeah the serpent was Satan and then they reject the whole concept because, we didn't cross our T's and Dot our eyes and what we're saying so the surprise.

 

Pastor Newms:

[36:49] Satan.

 

Pastor Bill:

[36:51] You could say a Satan that would be correct the serpent didn't have to lie to Eve because Adam had already lied to her.

 

Pastor Newms:

[37:01] And we know they were already naked and they immediately afterwards were afraid whether or not they felt shame is upto debate.

 

Pastor Bill:

[37:18] We infer that they felt shame because of the last verse of chapter 2.

 

Pastor Newms:

[37:24] Yeah that they didn't feel shame for being naked and then magically they were afraid so we assume it's because of Shame if you can tell we've had long discussions today.

 

Pastor Bill:

[37:35] We had long discussions today.

 

Pastor Newms:

[37:38] So um so because of that the, we know there were things that were not considered perfect that were happening before the fruit was eaten.

 

Pastor Bill:

[37:55] Because we've done extensive talking about the word sin literally just means imperfect it literally just means you're not perfect if you create a giant Jade statue and there's one Nick in it, that's it but that's in doesn't automatically ruin the whole statue.

 

Pastor Newms:

[38:22] Like the best frigerators are ones you buy from the scratch and dent place because, they have a little Dent that you're going to slide in anyway but it's half the price so scratch and dent is all you know doesn't necessarily mean, that's a dumb analogy but it's what came through my head so that's what you get.

 

Pastor Bill:

[38:44] And this is what Paul is talking about in the New Testament when he says that Christ redeems us from the laws of sin and death. The law of sin came or an understanding of the existence of the law of sin came when Adam and Eve ate the fruit, and the law of death came when Moses brought his law when God gave the law the that law to Moses That's the Law of death. Why do we call it the law of death we call that the law of death because God said hey do these things so death won't come as quickly. That's that was the whole point of the law was you guys are dying left right and Center let's let's Institute some logical steps to keep you from dying so much, stop doing this stop doing that start doing this start doing that stop eating those dang pigs you don't know how to cook them right to keep yourself from getting sick, stuff like that.

 

Pastor Newms:

[40:07] Stop touching dead people and then touching your.

 

Pastor Bill:

[40:11] Stop yeah stop touching dead people what stop.

 

Pastor Newms:

[40:13] You can't see pathogens but they they're they're stop touching.

 

Pastor Bill:

[40:19] Stop pooping inside your homes go do that outside the camp.

 

Pastor Newms:

[40:23] And let's be clear that's not because they didn't hit that not just because they didn't have indoor plumbing because I poop inside my home but it's because I have indoor plumbing.

 

Pastor Bill:

[40:34] The indoor plumbing takes it away they didn't have any.

 

Pastor Newms:

[40:36] Well most of the time.

 

Pastor Bill:

[40:40] They tell us they didn't have anything to just take magically take it away.

 

Pastor Newms:

[40:44] It's yes exactly.

 

Pastor Bill:

[40:45] Just sat there and infected the made them say, so what I've what I've the way I have come at it is that I've equated, the knowledge of Good and Evil with morality, and I've stated that having that knowledge of Good and Evil is what corrupted, Adam and Eve and their descendants that morality is corruption, and I've gone on to then say if you're using morality as a weapon to beat someone over the head, then you are literally embracing the very thing that caused God to say well man can't live forever because now they're going to be Little P bags like this guy. And on that point we've agreed you shouldn't weaponize morality, in between the two Newms and I don't agree on the specifics of what is morality what is ethics and, is it morality they gained when they ate the fruit or not and so, I've said my point of view extensively over over history and Pastor Newms today it was trying to explain you know where he's coming from and the way he sees it, and I think I'm I think I understand the way you see it at this point I don't think I have any hole so I'm going to try to express what I've learned about your point of view today.

 

Pastor Newms:

[42:42] Okay let's see.

 

Pastor Bill:

[42:47] And you've done a good job of already basically already stating a lot of the stuff that I'm about to say but you know we're recapping, Adam and Eve already had some sense of morality, they already knew some things are good some things are bad because God said don't eat the tree that's bad, and you can eat the other fruit that's good, already had some sense of morality, when they ate the knowledge of the tree of Good and Evil they then have the understanding and the knowledge of the law and understood not good and bad but right and wrong.

 

Pastor Newms:

[43:34] Yes.

 

Pastor Bill:

[43:34] So some things are good for you if some things are bad now we understand right and we understand wrong.

 

Pastor Newms:

[43:40] Yes.

 

Pastor Bill:

[43:41] Which is another facet of morality but, you can't just blanket statement morality over the situation because there was some sense of morality there before, and it wasn't like they just gained morality they already had it they gained a new facet and a new understanding.

 

Pastor Newms:

[44:03] That is my belief yes.

 

Pastor Bill:

[44:05] Of morality and in that then they had to suffer the consequences, of the knowledge like Paul says without the law there is no consequence, um so then that first consequence was we've always been naked and now we believe that to be wrong. So then they made Nathan's for themselves. Nathan it's the correct word, even even your King James Bible is translated today is translated wrong the word apron replace the word napron around the 1800s the late 1800s it was a napron, and because people began lazy other people thought they were saying an, apron but it is a napron. That people are lazy. A pronoun is a word that didn't exist until people got lazy and decided to not learn that it was natrone not that it wasn't a neighbor and they assumed it was an apron anyway, um and yes words have words changed meaning and they blah blah blah I get it I do but it is fun to say napron okay so I made the aprons for themselves, and they hid from God because they were afraid they weren't afraid of God before, before they had this knowledge of Good and Evil when God would show up they would just go oh hey it's god let's go hang out.

 

Pastor Newms:

[46:13] Uh-huh.

 

Pastor Bill:

[46:14] One-on-one in his presence and once they had this knowledge of Good and Evil they were afraid to enter into his presence there was a separation. Spiritually they did die, right because I became separated from God their innocence like like a child has innocence that guide for sure.

 

Pastor Newms:

[46:51] Well in one of the things that I found that I hadn't read before was, in Genesis where it says when the Lord's actually saying it it does not say you will die. Depending on the translation it will it says certainly or surely, die so it's not that even according to the translations we have, God didn't say you will die it said God said you will certainly die meaning, yeah now because you ate it you will certainly die when before there was a question of will these guys die, is how I take that verse and that is Genesis 2:17 that I'm referring to that I had not, paid attention to that one extra word that's in each of the three translations that I'm using, to show I just typed it yellow I misspelled Genesis.

 

Pastor Bill:

[48:29] Yeah it's, it's worthy of death. The actual word like pulled out of context and just, the word itself is to be worthy of death to be as if you were dead to being as good as dead too and it actually has the word twice meaning it should actually be an exclamation point, at the end of the sentence instead of a period.

 

Pastor Newms:

[49:02] Because it smooth smooth move move not just smooth.

 

Pastor Bill:

[49:10] And for some reason the translators decided to just put a period there instead of an exclamation point even though that's like one of the first things you learn when you're translating Hebrew and Greek is if they say a word twice, that's emphatic that's an exclamation point in Modern English.

 

Pastor Newms:

[49:28] Yeah life is fun.

 

Pastor Bill:

[49:33] And then and then and then, after they do eat it God says well now we need to stop them from continuing to eat from the tree of life because if they do, they're going to live forever in their current state. Slaves to the law of sin. Borrowing from you know New Testament axioms.

 

Pastor Newms:

[50:16] Which you know when you when you look at it is not. Necessarily part of the punishment that, is Mercy its after the Lord makes them close, it's after the punishments are done that he says since man has been like one of us knowing good and evil he must not reach out and take from because, God didn't want us continuing to live imperfect where we could not die and would not die to at some point become you know our perfect selves, in the afterlife because we wouldn't have had an afterlife we would have been stuck separated from God forever so.

 

Pastor Bill:

[51:18] Well they were already imperfect but they were imperfect without, but now that they have the knowledge of Good and Evil now that imperfection sticks and.

 

Pastor Newms:

[51:32] It mocks it up yeah.

 

Pastor Bill:

[51:33] And and damages your DNA and passes on corrupted DNA and then we get people born with diseases and deformities and you know.

 

Pastor Newms:

[51:56] Yes groggy we are damaged goods now.

 

Pastor Bill:

[51:56] Yes gravity says we're damaged goods and just like the book of Hosea. God likes him some damaged goods.

 

Pastor Newms:

[52:09] Really Hosea.

 

Pastor Bill:

[52:11] Yeah I was at where God tells Hosea.

 

Pastor Newms:

[52:13] I ain't I I know.

 

Pastor Bill:

[52:14] Make yourself go on your make yourself that whore, because she's gonna cheat on you she gonna do you wrong she's going to run around and then you're going to pursue her and she's going to come back to you just like I will pursue my.

 

Pastor Newms:

[52:33] You're not wrong it's just we went to Hosea.

 

Pastor Bill:

[52:38] We went to Hosea no I zadie says no I won't I don't know what she said is she saying she won't go marry a whore as I was just I don't know I don't know.

 

Pastor Newms:

[52:47] I don't understand what she's saying I know I won't too.

 

Pastor Bill:

[52:52] Jose tea.

 

Pastor Newms:

[52:54] I'm confused.

 

Pastor Bill:

[53:02] That's fine all right sounds like a fun time Groggy says. All right so go read Hosea thats your homework for this week.

 

Pastor Newms:

[53:19] No it's not has not the homework for the week.

 

Pastor Bill:

[53:23] Well we will be talking about whores next whores versus sluts next Sunday it's sure to be a good time so.

 

Pastor Newms:

[53:29] No no.

 

Pastor Bill:

[53:31] Tune in at 6:30 p.m. Central Standard.

 

Pastor Newms:

[53:33] Seriously hope we are not going to talk about thoughts next.

 

Pastor Bill:

[53:34] Sunday to join us live we thought says exactly what next week's episode titles going.

 

Pastor Newms:

[53:40] I know it.

 

Pastor Bill:

[53:44] So if you want to join us live on Sunday evenings we do me, on Sundays at 6:30 p.m. Central Standard time and it goes out live to Twitch YouTube and Facebook if you want to go to eat cake a DOT house you can find out which which which, Facebook in which YouTube channels you can join us live at and then you can participate in the chat and join us in the live conversation the way that zaidi and groggy and Biggs and Phoenix have, and a bat brain, sorry I'm trying not to burp over here on into the microphone so it's making my voice cut in and out, so come join us live we have a good time most Sundays and we try not to argue too much because that gets annoying to watch when we're just sitting here arguing back and forth we try to keep it, pretty light and have a good time but we're only human Rife with imperfection.

 

Pastor Newms:

[54:48] And I love arguing sorry.

 

Pastor Bill:

[54:51] So join us some Sunday we'd love to have you be a part of the conversation ask questions energetic to tell us we're wrong that's all welcome, fuels the conversation it's good fun, um and you can listen to this podcast anywhere that you listen to podcasts it comes up on Wednesdays at 7 p.m. so I'd encourage you to go back and look at the scriptures that we talked about, decide if you know where on the Mark or if we've missed the Mark here and what you you know, thank your you're seeing here and what you believe about these theological topics but remember that what what binds us together as Believers is that we believe, Jesus came as a man, died on the cross to deal with the law of sin and Death on our behalf fulfilled every jot and Tittle of the law to bring us salvation and that's the state that we live in now, is that state of Salvation so. Yeah and that's one of the things that Pastor Newms said earlier today he was like I hate this topic because it doesn't matter it isn't one of those things that matters and I'm like you know that's true but I, I can't fight this function that this is what we're supposed to talk about today so this is what we talked about and I feel like I learned something got some new insight on to, this topic I don't know if anybody else did but I certainly feel more knowledgeable here at the end of the day so that's good, it's always good to learn and grow and become, a better person and that's why I keep someone like Jonathan around me I have this rule that if you don't make me a better husband a better father or a better Christian then I ain't got time for you, and so that's why I spent a lot of time with Pastor Newms because he challenges me and all three of these areas and so, you do not all the same time and not all three everyday but you have no lack of challenging me in these three areas. Have a great week, we love you guys.

 

Pastor Newms:

Be safe out there.

 

Pastor Bill:

And until next time…

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